AirTran ranks LAST in monthly DOT on-time report

[BovineOne]

This news article is a couple weeks old, but hadn't been mentioned here yet.
Apr 2, 2004 article from Atlanta Journal-Consitution

Delta Air Lines and AirTran Airways both ranked at the bottom for on-time arrivals in February, according to the Department of Transportation's monthly performance reports.
...
AirTran, the second largest airline at Hartsfield-Jackson airport, ranked last with a 65.7 percent on-time rate.
....
AirTran and Delta ranked fifth and 14th, respectively, for baggage complaints. ASA was last, as has often been the case since it was added to the report last year.

(If that URL stops working, then you can try the original http://www.ajc.com/business/content/...04/02rank.html, but AJC.COM requires registration to view directly from their website.)

[Delta7203]

If all of the main airlines based at one airport come in last in on-time stats, logic tells us that it wasn't the airlines' fault. It was the many acts of God that made the airlines so late (meaning weather). These "Acts of God" would also make the number of baggage complaints go up due to failed connections and so on.

- John

[haze]

You betcha, anyone who flies regularly through ATL knows about the weather around here. Everyone thinks Seattle gets a lot of rain, but not even close to the nearly 60 inches annually Atlanta gets. Airlines based at ATL will always have the lowest on-time numbers due to the Atlanta weather (fog, ice, thick/tall thunderstorms, etc). Many of us have had this discussion around here before

On a side note, many people don't realize that AirTran refuses to "pad" it's flight schedule times like all other airlines do in order to allow for delays. I presume, however, that as they grow larger and larger and get more press about on-time performance, they may consider padding the schedule like everyone else...

Hey, 5th in baggage handling is fairly impressive though! And I believe they came in 7th or 8th "overall", right there in the middle with Continental

[haze]

You hit the nail on the head, Delta 7203. It's even stated in plain English in the article BovineOne is refering to:

"It was Atlanta," said Delta spokesman John Kennedy. He said air traffic at Atlanta was disrupted by fog and icing locally and by snowstorms in the Northeast during February.

Atlanta is also one the major "connecting" hubs in the country, so all other regions' weather problems are magnified here. I'm sure you've all heard the "Boston to London via Atlanta" jokes over the years, most everything used to route through ATL

[dbaker]

Classic response. It is still their fault that they're late if the weather is consistently bad in a city. You can't blame an "act of god" for a known risk, that's ridiculous.

This is the same mentality as outsourcing maintenance or 717 problems being Boeing's fault. Airtran picked the outsourcing company. Airtran picked the 717. People need to learn to be responsible for their own decisions.

If your airline is late because your hub has horrible weather, it's the airline's fault. They suck, not the weather. This is the same reason United's service in Chicago is horrible during the winter. Who would think to put an airline hub in Chicago?

America West is in Phoenix, which is brilliant. They don't have the weather delays like folks elsewhere.

[Delta7203]

Atlanta is NOT a bad city! The population of Metro Atlanta is bigger than that of 30 of the 50 states...I would like to see you go tell all of thoese people that their city SUCKS (that actually includes me when Im not flying).

Also, Delta and AirTran chose Atlanta as their main hub because of its location, population, and the make up of ATL's economy....Weather is just an afterthought when it comes to deciding on a hub.

- John

[jetmech717]

Typical outsider response......and I thought you wanted to be a pilot Baker? Here's a senario for you.....You live in California and you told your best friend "Bovineone" that you would be in NewYork for his wedding day. The day of the departure there is a earthquake rating 9.0 on the scale and the airport shuts down for damage. Now do you expect your friend to be mad at you for living in Cali or to be mad at the Airlines for not being in Vegas and making you drive there, or how about because the airline helped bring service to a city and just take nature's hand when it is delt because its a good city and they do good to fly in and out of it.

Baker:

This is the same mentality as outsourcing maintenance or 717 problems being Boeing's fault. Airtran picked the outsourcing company. Airtran picked the 717. People need to learn to be responsible for their own decisions.

Here we go again....the discussion was why is AirTran and Delta's on time arrivals so bad. Not to discuss the maintenace practices of them, but since you started it AirTran LOVES the 717. It is the best thing that has ever happened to us. You wont here anything different here. We have our "C" checks done at a 3rd party facility and at least it is in the USA were the FAA can keep close tabs on maintenace. We are not the only airline that does this, but you act like we are. If I tell you that Boeing is working with us on a problem then that means that Boeing is working with us on a problem. Now how in the hell is this blaming someone. Wake up Baker and pull you head out of 's a$$.

[Delta7203]

Baker...Why do you keep picking on AirTran?! If any airline needs to be looked at for fear of "wrong doings" and whatnot its Delta!! Yes, Delta!!...I mean, you do have to wonder how we saved $81million last year in Aircraft Maintenance/Repaires!

- John

P.S. It's a good thing I can't get fired for some of the things I say on this forum!!

[haze]

Originally Posted by dbaker

Classic response. It is still their fault that they're late if the weather is consistently bad in a city.

I gather you would rather Delta and AirTran throw all caution to the wind and consistently fly through severe weather endangering passenger's lives, just for the sake of having higher on-time rankings. It's reassuring that they prefer to put safety first. By the way, that was a quote from a Delta spokesman, not an AirTran employee. By the way part II: when ATL's new tower (tallest in the U.S.) and 5th runway are completed in 2005-6 it will be equipped with the most advanced inclement weather system in the nation, greatly increasing the number of departures/landings possible in "our type" of weather. I suspect delays in Atlanta may decrease as a result

Originally Posted by dbaker

This is the same mentality as outsourcing maintenance or 717 problems being Boeing's fault. Airtran picked the outsourcing company. Airtran picked the 717.

AirTran does the same amount of outsourcing as all airlines, nothing unusual there. AirTran picked what outsourcing company? Are you refering to ValuJet and SabreTech? You couldn't be more wrong my misinformed friend, AirTran couldn't have picked SabreTech for ValuJet because ValuJet was an airline based in Atlanta flying DC-9s and AirTran was an airline based in Orlando flying 737s. Yes, two different airlines entirely at that time, although you're always desperately trying to hide that fact because it doesn't fit in with your propaganda. Since when do airlines allow other airlines to choose their maintenance outsourcing for them? If you are indeed refering to the SabreTech fiasco, that was a pre-merger event that had everything to do with ValuJet in Atlanta and nothing to do with AirTran in Orlando. Like I've said before, you really need to get over your brain-lock and admit that ValuJet and AirTran were seperate entities entirely that merged AFTER VJ592, dropped the practices and culture of ValuJet, adopted the practices and culture of AirTran, and replaced the aging DC-9s and 737s of both airlines with brand spanking new 717s and new 737-700s and -800s on their way in June. One of THE youngest fleets on Earth

And if you know as much about the airline industry as you claim to, then you're already well aware that all new aircraft models have minor glitches their first few years. The launch customer is always the one who irons out these small kinks, with abundant assistance from the manufacturer. Boeing not responsible for minor glitches with the new 717? Then who is?! Talk about passing the buck

[haze]

Originally Posted by Delta7203

Baker...Why do you keep picking on AirTran

You haven't figured it out yet, Delta7203? dbaker picks on AirTran because he fears them. He doesn't "fear" they are dangerous or incompetent like he wants you to believe, but he actually fears their tremendous market force. It's pure jingoism, Southwest Airlines is from his neck of the woods and he doesn't want anybody else cutting in on their territory (like AirTran's recent and increasing expansion of their mini-hub in Dallas). And he's afraid that if the AirTrans of the world gain too much market share, they will forever alter the face of his triple crown platinum captain's club elite executive lounge lifestyle. And he basically has nothing to fear from Delta. AirTran, on the other hand, irks him and his like-minded cronies down to their respective mortal cores

And I love that

[haze]

...just watch the movie "Tucker" and you'll understand exactly why the "entrenched" want to squash AirTran

Whenever a new kid on the block comes along and does things differently for a lower price, the status quo always goes nuts

[haze]

Originally Posted by haze

...It's pure jingoism, Southwest Airlines is from his neck of the woods and he doesn't want anybody else cutting in on their territory (like AirTran's recent and increasing expansion of their mini-hub in Dallas)....

Speaking of cutting in on Southwest's territory:

AirTran Airways Announces New Nonstop Service Between Dallas/Ft. Worth and Los Angeles; Nonstop Service Begins July 1, 2004
Source: Comtex News Network (Business Wire)

AirTran Airways, a subsidiary of AirTran Holdings, Inc. (NYSE:AAI), today announced it will begin new nonstop service between Dallas/Ft. Worth International Airport and Los Angeles International Airport. The new nonstop flights will begin July 1, 2004.

"We are pleased to add this new service for our Dallas/Ft. Worth and Los Angeles customers," said Kevin Healy, vice president of planning and sales for AirTran Airways. "We are confident this new route will be a popular one for travelers seeking our high quality brand of low-fare service." AirTran Airways also currently offers nonstop service between Dallas/Ft. Worth and Atlanta, Baltimore, Orlando, and Las Vegas.

By the way, like dbaker I'm a big fan of Southwest airlines so this is not intended as a jab against them in any way. But I'm also a big fan of AirTran and Song and JetBlue and Frontier and...

You get the general idea. If you haven't already noticed, I'm a fiercely independent free market capitalist and that's why I have a problem with the stale, lumbering, entrenched network that are the legacy carriers. And that's also why I'm so enthralled by the dynamic go getters like Southwest, AirTran, and JetBlue. God knows I'm well aware that we need the legacy carriers, the loss of Delta would devestate my beloved state. But we also need the Southwests and the AirTrans and the JetBlues so the big boys stay on their toes. Nothing like a little fierce competition to keep everyone sharp as a tack

[haze]

Originally Posted by dbaker

They suck, not the weather.

Not according to Entrepreneur Magazine, who in the April 2004 issue named AirTran as best low-fare airline

[mduell]

Yes, someone needs to service ATL, but given the horrendous weather there, wouldn't it make sense to hub out of somewhere else?

[haze]

Originally Posted by mduell

Yes, someone needs to service ATL, but given the horrendous weather there, wouldn't it make sense to hub out of somewhere else?

Yes SOMEONE does need to service little ole Atlanta, it being the busiest airport in the world and all. But it definately makes a lot of sense to hub out due to their high volumes and inclement weather...

And that is exactly what AirTran is doing. If you'll go back to the main AirTran forum, you'll notice an article I recently posted about AirTran's expansion in Dallas (ironically not the best weather in the world either). In that post I also mention AirTran's movement away from the hub-and-spoke system in Atlanta and toward several mini-hubs in strategic regions, like Baltimore in the Northeast and Dallas in the Southwest. They've just begun implementing that structure in both Baltimore and Dallas over the past year or two, so the number of flights at either of those two airports isn't that substantial as of yet. Regardless, Atlanta will probably always be their main hub and there's even talk of moving their headquarters up from Orlando to there.

Atlanta has always been the home of Delta, was the home of Eastern, was the short-lived and unfortunate home of ValuJet, and just may become the new home of AirTran